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Cierva
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C.19 Mk III



-- Edited by hannetonIII on Friday 7th of October 2011 03:17:30 AM

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hannetonIII wrote:

Cierva R1.

http://wesworld.jk-clan.de/thread.php?threadid=1704&sid=2981484ea0d9e4e776930f57977ec2e0


 

You sure this one is legit? I've never heard of or seen a Cierva like this.



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Alan Dallas


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I think the answer lies in the fact that the site that the R-1 drawing comes from is a fantasy one. Looks very like a kamov design to me.smile



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The C.24 built by de Havilland in 1931, using a Cierva rotor head coupled to the cabin of a de Havilland DH.80A Puss Moth, and driven by a 120hp Gipsy III engine.



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Alan Dallas


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Ross wrote:

I think the answer lies in the fact that the site that the R-1 drawing comes from is a fantasy one. Looks very like a kamov design to me.smile


 True, but please notice that most photos on that page depict real-life aircraft. If you look at the picture file's name, it says "Cierva C.29" and that's exactly what it depicts.

I'm still wondering what the would-be "Cierva R1" is supposed to depict, though, if anything at all.



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Stéphane



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Stargazer2006 wrote:
 

 True, but please notice that most photos on that page depict real-life aircraft.


 I totally agree, the fact that this site mixes fact and fiction has given me grief in the past when I've thought that I've found a new type. I didn't dimiss the R-1 right away, had to stop and think about it.



-- Edited by Ross on Saturday 8th of October 2011 05:48:58 PM

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Cierva W.9 with fully enclosed fuselage.

From British Military Helicopters. John Everett-Heath, Arms & Armour Press 1986.



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Found this interesting Cierva in my archives, but I can't identify it. Help?



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Stingray wrote:

Found this interesting Cierva in my archives, but I can't identify it. Help?


 It looks like it maybe an early type of Gyrodyne design. The kind of design that J.A.J Bennet was working on at Cierva just before the second world war, and later developed when he went to Fairey, but I've never seen anything like it before.



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Made this crude profile drawing of the C.24 last night, for a member at SPF:

I hand-drew it in my tent, so my hands were shaky from the cold. Then I digitally processed it. I hope the detailing is accurate.



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Very nice effort, Travis!!


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Stéphane



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Ross wrote:
Stingray wrote:

Found this interesting Cierva in my archives, but I can't identify it. Help?


 It looks like it maybe an early type of Gyrodyne design.


 I stand corrected, it's not a Gyrodyne design. When enlarged you can see that the propellor is on the nose not a stub wing as I first thought. So I'm still none the wiser.



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I have the exact same picture (in much better quality) as a product of the Autogiro Co. of America—in other words: Pitcairn.



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Stéphane



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Many thanks Stargazer2006, thats much clearer.



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As I mentioned above, the Fairey Gyrodyne design originated in a proposal that Dr J.A.J.Bennett put forward for the Cierva Company to meet the specification S.22/38 for a naval rotary-wing spotter/reconnaissance aircraft.

The two images are from U.S patent 2317340 and show what is probably the basic layout of the Cierva C.41 design. They show subtle differences.

The full patent can be found here. http://www.google.com/patents?id=Ic5GAAAAEBAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=2317340&hl=en&ei=E9yRTr7tA5K68gO-_8gR&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CC8Q6AEwAA



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3 view drawing of the W.11 Air Horse, showing the modified and extended fins on the tailplane. From Jane's All The Worlds Aircraft 1950-51.



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The C.10, before and after the crash:



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The model of the projected twin engined version of the Air Horse, the W.11T, first shown at Farnborough in 1949, still exists at the Helicopter Museum in Weston Super Mare.



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The "Spraying Mantiss" as it appears in U.S Patent 2529629.



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Nice find, Ross. Thanks!


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Just after the war, Cierva were also investigating the use of rotor tip jet drive for helicopters.

From U.S Patent 2673696.



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What would appear to be the last projected Air Horse development, before Cierva stopped work. Of special interest is the folding rotor system, which implies a Naval application. Perhaps a potential competitor to Bristol's Type 191 or designed for on-board delivery.

From U.S Patent 2623711.



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Variations on the Cierva W.9 theme.

The first image from U.S Patent 2503172, shows the version with Jet Reaction control. The system used by the W.9. (Compare with photo at start of this thread).

The second from U.S Patent 2440225, shows a version with a tailplane.

The third and fourth from U.S Patent 2613748, show a version with a curious fan arrangement.



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Another Jet Driven Rotor concept from Cierva. From U.S Patent 2703624. Very curious rotor shape.



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hannetonIII wrote:

Cierva R1.

http://wesworld.jk-clan.de/thread.php?threadid=1704&sid=2981484ea0d9e4e776930f57977ec2e0


 

That's the Kamov Ka-18!!!

Never trust that site as a source for anything. no



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Ross wrote:

As I mentioned above, the Fairey Gyrodyne design originated in a proposal that Dr J.A.J.Bennett put forward for the Cierva Company to meet the specification S.22/38 for a naval rotary-wing spotter/reconnaissance aircraft.

The two images are from U.S patent 2317340 and show what is probably the basic layout of the Cierva C.41 design. They show subtle differences.

The full patent can be found here. http://www.google.com/patents?id=Ic5GAAAAEBAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=2317340&hl=en&ei=E9yRTr7tA5K68gO-_8gR&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CC8Q6AEwAA


 May be your was right Ross,

 

that is because,the C.41 was a four-seat autogyro project.



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hesham


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From TU 243,

the CL-11 was developed from CL-10,powered by one 100 hp Renault 7B engine,remained a Project.



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hesham


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Am I correct to assume that the Cierva-Shorts C.14 gyro was a flying boat type like the C.13 or was it a completely different project? I'm fact-checking against vague Google results.



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Hi,

looks like this;

http://www.flightglobal.com/PDFArchive/View/1935/1935%20-%200631.html



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KQstardust wrote:

Am I correct to assume that the Cierva-Shorts C.14 gyro was a flying boat type like the C.13 or was it a completely different project? I'm fact-checking against vague Google results.


 

Stéphane made it pretty clear in the designations topic that no details have survived to indicate exactly what the C.14, C.15, and C.16 projects actually were, so assuming any relation with Shorts or development around the C.13 is pure speculation that is likely to never be proven. Such as it is with designs forever lost to history.



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