Cierva

Former Deputy Administrator

Cierva

hesham · Veteran Member - Level 3

Hi,

here is Cierva W.7 and may be W.8;

http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1946/1946%20-%201154.html?search=helicopter+project+1946&tracked=1

Commander31 · Veteran Member - Level 3

hesham wrote:
Hi,

here is Cierva W.7 and may be W.8;

http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1946/1946%20-%201154.html?search=helicopter+project+1946&tracked=1

Thanks, but there is a mistake. The first aircraft is captioned as a Weir project, not Cierva.

Former Deputy Administrator

Further reading of the PDF file identifies the first one as the Weir Type W.7 Gyrodyne, while the Cierva one is simply titled "Cierva Gyrodyne".

Stingray · Administrator

Cierva W.11 Air Horse, found at SPF.

hesham · Veteran Member - Level 3

Hi,

for Cierva projects;

C.14 was a flying boat Autogyro for the 31/26

Spec.,and the Shorts Brother who was developed it.
C.31 was a project of 1934 for a two-seat coupe autogyro with
retractable landing gear and powered by one 385hp Napier Rapier
IV engine.
C.32 was similar to C.31 but powered by one 200 hp De Havilland
DH Gipsy Six engine.
C.33 (Avro-665) was an Avro project ,envisaged the combination
of a four-seat Commodore biplane with a three-blade rotor,powered
by one 240 hp Armstrong Siddeley Lynx IVC engine.
C.37 was a twin-engined cabin autogyro,prposed by Avro as the
Type-668.
C.39 was a project for 2/3 seat fleet spotter autogyro to Spec.
22/38,this would have had a three-blade rotor and 600 hp Rolls-
Royce kestrel engine.

And an amphibian autogiro.

http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1935/1935%20-%200631.html

Stargazer2006 · Former Deputy Administrator

I personally wouldn't call the Air Horse "little-known", although it remained a prototype. It is well documented and illustrated. Depending on generations and areas of interest, what is unknown to some may be very well known to others...

Stargazer2006 · Former Deputy Administrator

Thanks for giving Cierva a topic of its own! Without this company there would scarcely have been any autogyro at all!!!

hannetonIII · Veteran Member - Level 2

I never saw these before so i guess they are little known... to me ,lol.

Stingray · Administrator

Stargazer2006 wrote:
... I really do wonder if it wouldn't be best to have a "unbuilt projects" topic on one side and a "little-known rotorcraft" on the other. There is just too much stuff of different nature in this thread.

I have wondered the same thing myself, if they should be separate. I personally don't like to split categories up too much, it just makes certain aircraft harder to look up on the forum. Besides, I can't do any splitting or merging yet until ActiveBoard reads the user suggestions and adds that feature.

hesham · Veteran Member - Level 3

The Cierva C.33.

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.fildes3/Type%20602%20to%20862

hesham · Veteran Member - Level 3

Avro 668

hesham · Veteran Member - Level 3

By the way,

the Avro-668 was also called Cierva C.37.

Stargazer2006 · Former Deputy Administrator

Cierva

Stargazer2006 · Former Deputy Administrator

Parnall Gyroplane (Cierva C.10 and C.11)

Ross · Veteran Member - Level 1

Cierva

Stingray · Administrator

I think that might be a mistake. From what I've read, W.10 was a designation assigned to a 4- to 5-seat single-engine helicopter project.

I'm still looking in to it.

VinceJ · Veteran Member - Level 3

C.10 was a 4-blade autogyro that crashed in 1927.

hannetonIII · Veteran Member - Level 2

Vince are you referring to the W.10 being discussed? If you are then I have to say you got the wrong aircraft. You're right about the C.10, but then a similar design with more powerful engine was developed shorly after called the C.11. The aircraft after the W.10 was the W.11 Air Horse, a large aircraft with 3 main rotors. My point is that you're mixing the W designations with the C designations, which were really different aircraft!1

VinceJ · Veteran Member - Level 3

Says the guy who'se never seen these before? smile

hannetonIII · Veteran Member - Level 2

That was almost a whole year ago, so of course I learned more about them through that period of time. Not enough to make a designation list like Stephane, but enough to make some helpful corrections.

VinceJ · Veteran Member - Level 3

Sorry I was joking. I saw the date you posted that.

What I meant to say was Thank you for correcting me. And do you know about the W.10 then?

hannetonIII · Veteran Member - Level 2

No prob! biggrin

Nope, the W.10 is a new one. Everytime I search for it I keep getting the C.10 instead.

Pepper · Veteran Member - Level 3

It was as Stingray said a single-engined five-seater project, and it was definately a helicopter, not the usual autogyro. Apparently Cunliffe-Owen Aircraft built a prototype before Weir ceased investment in the Cierva company in 1948 due to the W.11 crash.

What happened with the design after that I'm not sure. Maybe it was known under a Saunders-Roe heading by then?

-- Edited by Pepper on Wednesday 5th of October 2011 01:21:49 AM

Gunship · Veteran Member - Level 3

W.10 was abandoned in favor of developing the W.11.

Anthony, the first helicopter by Saunders-Roe was designated W.14 and it was AFAIK the one and only design post-Cierva/Weir with a W. After that they used P as their prefix, so it wouldn't make any sense at all that a "P.10" exist under their name.

Stingray · Administrator

Thanks for all of your input. Mystery solved.

And here is the real aircraft depicted in Ross' articles:

The "Spraying Mantis" (projected modification to W.11) designed by Pest Control Ltd. and the Cierva Autogiro Co., Ltd., and claimed to be exclusively for agricultural work.

Ross · Veteran Member - Level 1

Thanks to everyone for their comments,

I agree that the aircraft shown is the "Spraying Mantis". A mock-up built by Cunliffe-Owen for Cierva. It was never built as the real thing, during wind tunnel tests it was found that it was far better to have the single rotor at the front rather than the rear. The design was changed and Cierva also decided to capitalise on the potential load carrying capabilities for both military and civil applications by having an enclosed fuselage fitted, thus the W-11 Air Horse as we know it emerged. Pest-Control Ltd lost interest in the project when they found that crop spraying could be performed easier and more cheaply by smaller helicopters.

On a separate note the Cierva designation W.14 applied to the first two Skeeters built the Mks 1 & 2. When Saro took over responsibility for the design it became their P.501.

Stargazer2006 · Former Deputy Administrator

Thanks Ross for explaining the connection between the AIR HORSE and SPRAYING MANTIS, which was never too clear until now. I knew the Mantis came first, but didn't know how and why it had evolved.

hesham · Veteran Member - Level 3

Hi,

for Cierva W.12 project;

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,4283.msg33837.html#msg33837

-- Edited by hesham on Friday 7th of October 2011 09:45:33 PM

hannetonIII · Veteran Member - Level 2

Cierva R1.

http://wesworld.jk-clan.de/thread.php?threadid=1704&sid=2981484ea0d9e4e776930f57977ec2e0